[chaadster]

My sales team didn't think Mods were frowned upon and in fact they said they had the burden of proof on them to prove that mods caused issues to which you could then go back to the mod company and recoup losses Id imagine possibly. So I'm wondering if the less expensive throttle mapping (pedal lag) fixes that are out there have proven useful? What about the tunes that give about 80hp more, do they include a smoothing out of the initial acceleration?

I should add I have the Q4 with LSD..not sure if that makes a difference.

The car needs to be running right before you do any tuning, and I’m sure if you ask any of the tuners, they’ll tell you as much.

Get it checked out. From what you describe, it sounds odd to me; I notice some lag and recognize the surging from boost, but the intensity and impact on driveability is unfamiliar, so I think it’s worth checking out. Comparing it to another Giulia at the dealer is a good idea, and should make something clear either way.

It’s also true, in my experience, that the car breaks in and smooths out in time, but this sounds like it could be something else. Mine was delivered with very little mileage, I forget, but maybe around 10, so it was very green when I got it and drives better now, at 6k miles, than it did when new.

 

[Bender]

I'm going to try and summarize my experience here a bit better especially since it seems worse today. The car has about 740 miles on it, came to me with about 300 on Saturday (car was driven between dealers)

-Pulling out as it would appear to a passer by, would look as if I were on a very casual drive ...for the first 2 seconds.
-Then you would notice the car jerk suddenly and start to accelerate for a second or 2...
-Then the turbo kicks in and the car surprises you and I'm sure to the passer by they are noticing some herky jerky steering to accommodate for the recent warp drive enabled feeling.

There just is no casual egress with quickness in this car...it goes from almost nothing to far too much when you really want to get it out there quickly and push the pedal 3/4 to all the way down.

The only solace is that I can time for this delay and at 1/2 pedal the car is much more manageable.

I'm not sure how I missed this on my test drives. I likely was being a bit cautious on the test drive and not really getting on it too much unless I was already 'at speed' and was adding acceleration through bends etc to test handling and power pull at 60+ mph for example.

Not sure what to do. I already need to take the car in for the brakes clunking so I guess I will ask that they check this out for me too....sigh.

This is DEFINITELY a dealer issue.

 

[AlfaRomeoCares]

I gave up reading post as they had the same theme either 1. yes the lag sucks or 2. is this your first time driving a turbo, do you have the car turned on, do you have gas in the car.......sigh.

Yes, I have gas in the car.
No this is not my first turbo.
No this is not my first car with auto shut down...and yes, I hit that button as soon as I get into the car after starting it.
Yes, I'm using premium gas.
No, the car isn't on its first tank, 3rd...and no I gave it no break in period nor should I but old school here I am going to change the oil asap.
The pedal lag is pedal lag...push the pedal...nothing happens or very little... It's NOT turbo lag

....this is NOT a dead stop issue, it happens at 30mph too.

*Final note: This is still a nice car, and fun to drive. I wish it had a bit more power but if it did I likely would have a color I didn't like with options missing as I would have impulse purchased at first drive.

Hi hypersloth,

If you end up taking it into the dealer, let me know. I am available via direct message and would be happy to get this over to a Case Specialist who'll work with you and the dealer toward a potential solution.

Jasmine
Alfa Romeo Social Care Specialist

 

[CytokineStorm]

My car is doing this now too. I took in it last month for the 10,000 mile service and they also performed the t57 update. It is very obviously different now, so much so that even my 14 daughter noticed. Also, a few friends that ride with me pointed it out too. There is definitely a few seconds delay; before, when I would punch it, it would launch! Now it doesn’t even come close. This was definitely not the case before I took it in last month. It’s back at the dealership for some HVAC issues (temp differences between driver and passenger, total shut down of fan, and fogging issues I’ve been complaining about for months) and I mentioned it when I dropped it off. We’ll see what they say.

Mine started after getting the T57 update as well. When I mentioned at the dealership, the service guy said it was because the T57 update reset all of the "learned" habits of your driving when it came to the transmission. He said if you drove with a heavy foot before, it would be pretty noticeable until you break it back in. I'm not sure how true it is but it sort of makes sense. I just find it weird because it doesn't always have this delay.

 

[CytokineStorm]

I'm going to try and summarize my experience here a bit better especially since it seems worse today. The car has about 740 miles on it, came to me with about 300 on Saturday (car was driven between dealers)

-Pulling out as it would appear to a passer by, would look as if I were on a very casual drive ...for the first 2 seconds.
-Then you would notice the car jerk suddenly and start to accelerate for a second or 2...
-Then the turbo kicks in and the car surprises you and I'm sure to the passer by they are noticing some herky jerky steering to accommodate for the recent warp drive enabled feeling.

There just is no casual egress with quickness in this car...it goes from almost nothing to far too much when you really want to get it out there quickly and push the pedal 3/4 to all the way down.

The only solace is that I can time for this delay and at 1/2 pedal the car is much more manageable.

I'm not sure how I missed this on my test drives. I likely was being a bit cautious on the test drive and not really getting on it too much unless I was already 'at speed' and was adding acceleration through bends etc to test handling and power pull at 60+ mph for example.

Not sure what to do. I already need to take the car in for the brakes clunking so I guess I will ask that they check this out for me too....sigh.

I think quite a few people noticed this after the T57 update. My car went from punchy to delayed as well. I would bet that is the culprit between your test drive and what the car currently is.

 

[Eagle7]

Mine started after getting the T57 update as well. When I mentioned at the dealership, the service guy said it was because the T57 update reset all of the "learned" habits of your driving when it came to the transmission. He said if you drove with a heavy foot before, it would be pretty noticeable until you break it back in. I'm not sure how true it is but it sort of makes sense. I just find it weird because it doesn't always have this delay.

I haven't gotten the T57 yet, but it is true that these cars 'learn' how you drive, and over time slowly make adjustments to the performance of the car. The transmission seems to be the biggest culprit in determining acceleration performance. If the T57 resets the trans memory, that's going to suck because right now my car is running like a jeweled watch. Oh well...guess I'll just have to put some more miles on it afterwards...darn.

 

[Racer Z]

Mine started after getting the T57 update as well. When I mentioned at the dealership, the service guy said it was because the T57 update reset all of the "learned" habits of your driving when it came to the transmission. He said if you drove with a heavy foot before, it would be pretty noticeable until you break it back in. I'm not sure how true it is but it sort of makes sense. I just find it weird because it doesn't always have this delay.

It is a learning ECU and takes a few hundred miles to run-in and get fully acclimated. But, my experience with the T57 was that even in the first mile it ran better and shifted smoother. She is still a little un-smooth while cold, and I'm OK with that as that's short lived, about one city block. How she drives after fully warm is my main concern.

It is possible that they returned your car to you with a low battery and you need to for a nice long drive on a nice winding road. Run-in the ECU, charge the battery fully, and have fun doing it.

 

[AlfaRomeoCares]

Hello everyone,

If you decide you'd like to get this looked at by the dealer, please let me know. I'd be glad to help however I can and get this escalated if needed,

Jasmine
Alfa Romeo Social Care Specialist

 

[lockem]

Mine does not exhibit that behavior, and as I said, if I’m foot off the brake and off accel, the car moves forward.

It is definitely true, for mine at least. Not noticeable once car is warmed up, but when it's cold the idle with car in Drive and foot on the brake goes up to ~1100 rpm, lift off of brake a little and drops to ~900, foot back on brake it goes back up to ~1100. It is going in and out of neutral. I have also felt a jerk if going from brake to gas very quickly.

In the scenarios you both described, the feature would be disabled 1. foot on the accelerator 2. brakes not engaged 3. on a hill. Alfa actually did a pretty good job masking this one!

I can confirm that my MY2018 Q4 also behaves this way when cold. Pull up to an stop sign, stop, wait about 1 second, then observe neutral engages and engine RPM increase with no strain against the brakes.

MacGeek already said that the car automatically switches to neutral when stopped. Although I voiced my doubts a while back, who am I to doubt The MacGeek?

I am wondering if there is an interlock with the turn signal to moderate power production.

I also wonder if the car's rather substandard 500kbps "high speed CAN bus" is causing problems. I believe other cars run the bus at 2000kbps.

There is also a "low speed CAN bus" that apparently carries a lot of user control information that also has potential to be overloaded and causing problems.

CAN is a collision based bus like the original Ethernet and the Alohanet on which Ethernet is based, which behaves very non-linearly and badly as it approaches overload.

 

[Motoren]

I have this issue too. You floor the pedal and it just takes loooong to react.
When I'm in traffic and just know I have to or want to move fast I just make sure the car is in Dynamic and the first gear selected in Manual Mode, this is the way the car reacts the quickest.
I´ve noticed something actually happens when you do this. I don't know if someone can explain what engages with the transmission but you will notice what I'm saying this way:
Stand still in Drive, car in Dynamic Mode. Still in Drive, downshift with the left paddle to select first gear (it appears D1 in the dashboard), afterwards move the gear lever to the left to manual mode. This is when the dashboard changes to M1 and you can feel something actually engaging in the car.
You would imagine that the car should be in first gear being in Drive / D1 / M1 but M1 is not the same.
So my guess is there's something different having the car in Manual Mode 1st gear vs 1st gear in drive or just drive.

Let me know if someone notices it too or if someone knows what happens.

Mario A

 

[lockem]

What version code do you have? I believe that the 85 and higher versions (MY2018 and later) indicate that you have the "driveability" fix which seems to address some of the initial acceleration lag.

Of course the car exhibits turbo lag, like any turbocharged car.

It might be worth noting that my wife's 2013 Subaru Cross trek (NA engine) sometimes does not respond promptly to throttle changes. Maybe this is a smog thing?

 

[Chipshot]

What I have experienced (and now compensate for) feels more like transmission hesitation than turbo lag.

 

[wingler]

I have this issue too. You floor the pedal and it just takes loooong to react.
When I'm in traffic and just know I have to or want to move fast I just make sure the car is in Dynamic and the first gear selected in Manual Mode, this is the way the car reacts the quickest.
I´ve noticed something actually happens when you do this. I don't know if someone can explain what engages with the transmission but you will notice what I'm saying this way:
Stand still in Drive, car in Dynamic Mode. Still in Drive, downshift with the left paddle to select first gear (it appears D1 in the dashboard), afterwards move the gear lever to the left to manual mode. This is when the dashboard changes to M1 and you can feel something actually engaging in the car.
You would imagine that the car should be in first gear being in Drive / D1 / M1 but M1 is not the same.
So my guess is there's something different having the car in Manual Mode 1st gear vs 1st gear in drive or just drive.

Let me know if someone notices it too or if someone knows what happens.

Mario A

Responds quicker if you don't floor it. You can also buy a pedal booster (Madness GoPedal for example).

 

[Il_Conte]

What I have experienced (and now compensate for) feels more like transmission hesitation than turbo lag.

I know exactly what you mean by compensating for it. When I have to go between traffic, I hit the gas 1 second before it’s clear- so the car moves at the desired moment.
It’s probably my least favorite part of this car. My old Escape had instant (weak, but literally instant) response to the pedal.

 

[bhvrdr]

Id have the car looked at. Its throttle lag but thats alot.

This engine is a little torque monster. It makes peak torque of 295ftlb at 2250rpm which means the little quick spooling turbo is starting to spool off idle. Heck the car has a diesel like redline of 5800rpm. Its not a top end car but it has great torque.

The issue is throttle lag not turbo lag. It shouldn't be lagging 3 seconds though. Thats an issue. If its really more like a half second thats normal and can be remedied by throttle controllers like sprint boosters

Mike

 

[JeFizz]

Mine does the same, it's no exaggeration that it could be close to 1 second before the car jumps after slamming the pedal to the floor from 0 throttle. If you roll on the throttle it's fine, but it doesn't know what to do with 0%-100% throttle. I am completely up to date on everything as of a couple weeks ago.

 

[wingler]

Mine does the same, it's no exaggeration that it could be close to 1 second before the car jumps after slamming the pedal to the floor from 0 throttle. If you roll on the throttle it's fine, but it doesn't know what to do with 0%-100% throttle. I am completely up to date on everything as of a couple weeks ago.

Well, as the old joke goes — “doctor, it hurts when I do this, what’s your recommendation”. Doctor‘s reply “well, don’t do that”!

 

[-ds-]

I have noticed this car is the same as my Audi was and the BMW is. Roll the throttle and no lag, slam the throttle down and lag. It's annoyed me a couple times when accelerating out of a situation is the correct thing to do.

I wonder if it is a "safety feature" in throttle by wire systems for when people panic and suddenly slam down the accelerator instead of the brake...

I am almost curious enough to ask a friend i know that works on those systems.

 

[millerc117]

I've experimented with throttle inputs for the past 2 months or so. I discovered that stabbing the throttle hard to the floor will actually make you accelerate slower. It has nothing to do with turbo lag, but rather the nature of electronic throttles. Your pedal input is not linear to the actual throttle like a physical cable would be. There is a logical process that the computer has to calculate based on the current state of conditions. Your pedal inputs are translated to the engine through an electronic graph that the manufacture sets. It basically reads different data points, such as throttle percentage and velocity of pedal pressure, then commands the engine to react based on that data. However, if you tell the system to go from 0% to 100% in the matter of half a second, it is going to react very slowly due to the relative distance between the data points. It's all processed on a curve, so the car can't go straight from one point to another. It has to follow the curve and artificially fill all the gaps in between. If you squeeze the throttle slowly overtime rather than mashing it to the floor, it allows the computer to adjust quicker because you're giving it time to read the gradual inputs and react appropriately.

 

[bhvrdr]

Mine does the same, it's no exaggeration that it could be close to 1 second before the car jumps after slamming the pedal to the floor from 0 throttle. If you roll on the throttle it's fine, but it doesn't know what to do with 0%-100% throttle. I am completely up to date on everything as of a couple weeks ago.

I just tried to pull onto a 55mph road from a side street. Steering wheel probably turned 45 degrees while stopped.

I had an opening in traffic and pinned the throttle and the car inched out into traffic like it was in limp mode. Im watching the 55mph traffic get closer and closer like its in slow motion...

... and probably 2 secs goes buy and its like the throttle input was finally accepted and the car hooks up and takes off hard. Scary.

It definitely wasnt turbo lag. I cant tell if its throttle lag perhaps from an over restrictive stability control not allowing those throttle inputs with the steering wheel turned or if its transmission lag.

Im going to test the same scenario (minus the traffic lol) in manual mode (starting in guaranteed 1st gear) vs also starting with race mode enabled to see if either one makes a difference.

Car really pissed me off on that one.