[Drew]

They are fairly sturdy and although they sound like they are going to break, they don't, well most of them anyway. I had a couple break on one door and none on the other purely because I did not pull the door panel at the right position close to where the clips are. It is always the blue part of the door insert that break or come away, if not broken they can be reused. Replacement clips are cheap though, I got these.

Front & Rear Door Card Clips, Alfa Romeo 6000626334

These distinctive blue and white trim clips are used on some of the latest Alfa Romeo models. They are fitted to the Stelvio and Giulia and are used to secure the front and rear door cards. Each clip includes an integrated rubber washer and has a sprung head which reduces cabin noise and...

www.vehicleclips.co.uk

You never gave us a sound review.

 

[Triumph23]

You never gave us a sound review.

I wanted to give it a good few weeks before updating. So far I think these speakers are still a bit on the bright side. There is more tight clear bass, mids are balanced but the treble is a little clinical and bright. When I play RnB, pop and anything with beats it sound great. Plenty of low Bass. For rock music it lacks that warmth. A big improvement over the stock speakers I would say. The sound quality is there for sure, suits certain types of music more than others. I now want to upgrade the tweeters but I am unable to remove the stock frickin tweeters. I will have to give it another go sometime. Have a set of Hertz mille OE tweeters as posted earlier.

 

[Drew]

Yea. Hopefully you can swap out the tweeters and get the full experience.

 

[mikoz]

Are there yet any plug n play replacement upgrades for the HK system?
I'm not interested in adding a box to the trunk, even though it may have sonic advantages.

 

[AlfaAndy]

Are there yet any plug n play replacement upgrades for the HK system?
I'm not interested in adding a box to the trunk, even though it may have sonic advantages.

x2 on that. Has anyone found a better sub driver that will install in the same place with little to no mods? I would like a little more low bass, but don't want a big box in the trunk.

 

[mikoz]

x2 on that. Has anyone found a better sub driver that will install in the same place with little to no mods? I would like a little more low bass, but don't want a big box in the trunk.

I noticed that crutchfield now actually has a database of fitment, this wasnt the case last time I looked. nothing for the sub though, just doors and front dash. Seems like most require redrilling to fit.

Find what fits your car - Crutchfield

Let us know what you drive, and we'll show you exactly what works in your ride. Get FREE 2-day shipping, discounted installation gear, and free custom instructions.

www.crutchfield.com

 

[AlfaAndy]

@mikoz , good to know. This is progress!

 

[dananton485]

Ok the speakers have arrived along with the adaptors. Not sure if they are correct adaptors until I open the door card.

I got a pair of Hertz Mille Pro 165.3 , 4 ohm components to begin with. I will add more slowly if required. These have a good range 40Hz to 20k plus and high sensitivity of 92dB. So should be fine with factory amp. Most importantly they are built fantastic with heavy solid castings. Oozes quality and have good reviews. Even better, they are Italian!

I will hopefully try to swap them this weekend.

View attachment 104348 View attachment 104349

HI, I'd be interested to hear what you think of your new speakers. I looked these up and they are pretty up there but I'd consider them. I've been considering a number of options. First I was looking at the JL C1 650 which I know are entry level but I had that tweeter before in a previous system and really liked it. Not sure of the C1's performance for midbass??. If I did put the C1's in I would use my own crossover as the provided ones at this price point are lame. I also would swap out the .75" driver for the 1" C1 driver that is still cost effective at that price point. I guess the main concern about the C1 is if the sub bass is good since I am looking for an upgrade from the the factory OEM Mid bass that I think is pretty darn good already. I also like the idea of the Morel Maximo 6 yet another entry-level component and it seems to preview very well on the Crutchfield web preview tool. In fact, it seems on par with speakers at much higher price points. I actually like it just as well, if not a little better than the Morel Virtus 602 ($620). I keep going back to it and never seem disappointed by the preview of it. Not sure how good the Crutchfield preview tool is but I always select the same volume level setting and I can tell the difference between say a coaxial and a nice component. It is harder sometimes to compare the higher quality components but I do notice differences. Another speaker that seems to sound good on the preview site is the Focal Performance 165AS ($380) it sounded a little bit bright by it has an adjustable tweeter output so that could be addressed as needed. Finally, I also put in your Hertz Millie Pro 165's and they sounded great too the main difference seemed to be a strong vocal presence that is very lifelike yet not harsh. I assume the mid-bass on that unit is fantastic as well. Probably the main thing I don't like about your speakers is the price ($600). At this point, I am thinking to go with the Morel Maximo 6 or possibly the Morel Maximo Ultra MkII which is a little more expensive but may have a better midbass driver. Ironically the more expensive Maximo Ultra MkII has a 6 dB crossover that I would toss anyway but I thought that was funny how the Maximo 6 actually had a better crossover design. I actually will most likely use my high-end MB crossovers with either of those Morels which I have done with other speakers in the past with very positive results. Obviously, if I stepped up the Morel Virtus 602 or your Hertz Millie Pro 165's I would use their crossovers since I'm sure they're very high quality. I'm not really apt to go up to that price point though but you never know.

I went to a local shop to preview some speakers. What a lame experience they didn't even have all their speakers on the board hooked up and I had to wait about a half hour before the guy got off the phone to help me. Even then It was not clear once they hooked it up I mean at the store I was previewing the JL lines. The c2 series seemed nice just as good as the c3 and of course the C1 it was harder to tell cause the source unit didn't seem so great. As usual, the salesperson was highly suggesting the Infinity Kappa series which in general I have never been fond of.

 

[Shiny_side_up]

the Hertz Mille is what I run up front in my older SUV. Audison 5.1k amp, original Audison bit one, 5 channel active setup. With the time alignment and the range the door woofers can reach, it sounds like all the bass is coming from the doors (10" sub in spare tire well doing all the real work). I also find their tweeters very light and non-fatiguing. I think your "door performance" will come more from prepping and sealing the door than it will from the speaker itself. Historically you can't go wrong with the Focal, Morel, or Hertz. So not having heard all 3 recently, I'd probably base my decision mostly on the tweeters.

 

[dananton485]

the Hertz Mille is what I run up front in my older SUV. Audison 5.1k amp, original Audison bit one, 5 channel active setup. With the time alignment and the range the door woofers can reach, it sounds like all the bass is coming from the doors (10" sub in spare tire well doing all the real work). I also find their tweeters very light and non-fatiguing. I think your "door performance" will come more from prepping and sealing the door than it will from the speaker itself. Historically you can't go wrong with the Focal, Morel, or Hertz. So not having heard all 3 recently, I'd probably base my decision mostly on the tweeters.

Great info what models of the Morel an Focal did you listen too? I have virtually listening to a number of speakers on Cruthfield but I'm not sure how reliable their virtual tool is. My primary concern is nice tight bass (or some would call this mid-bass). I generally run the lower end of my components full range and just go with the natural roll off. Will most likely support the system with a small 8" subwoofer. UPDATE: Zapco amp was DOA so I went with two 4 ch JL RD/400. One RD 400 will be bridged in stereo 2x200w and the 2nd amp will run the rear fills from ch 1&2 and channels 3&4 will bridge to run as single Polk 8” DB+ sub at 200w @4ohms.

 

[loheiman]

@Unique

Apologies for the long and perhaps boring post...
Following my service at Alfa last week I tried connecting straight to the ECM again. This time it sounded ok when I connected before making any adjustments other than I appeared to be picking up what sounded like white noise someowhere along my signal path. As previously it was almost at unlistenable volumes even as low at 10. First thing I did was turn my amps gains right down and this got rid of the noise (they were almost at peak as a cure for the ETM cutting out a high volume). After adjusting the gain on my DSP (marignal change) then the amps it does seem to sound better than before even before I did any EQ or tuning. Bear in mind I still have the OEM tweeters in as I am struggling to get the covers off.
For any other's out there, I checked the ETM output with a 1kHz 0dB sine wave on my scope and got a clean signal up to volume 28. On volume 29 it was clearly clipping. I tried various other frequency test tones (all at 0dB) and all were clean at volume 28. Previously when using the HK amplifier, even at full volume, there was no visible clipping so I suspect even at full volume the ETM or HK amp are not actually at their peaks (maybe due to having to split the signal up into so many channels, I don't know). The ETM output is noticably louder than the HK amp outputs too. Maybe this is a symptom of having to sum up all the channels with the HK amp.
As a work around for the rear channels (I don't really use them but may have on the lowest possible setting using the fader so the kids can hear something other than pure bass) I connected the rear output from the ETM direct to the rear speakers outputs of the HK amp. Works very well. Obviously not as loud as my amplified front outputs but does what I need it to do.
The sat nav volume was ridiculously loud compared to the music even with it on minimum but bizarrely when I corrected the gains it now works correctly. Not sure why but it corrected the issue.
Also, even though I changed byte 112 to 20 using MES and the volume control etc working correctly, if I disconnect plug B from the HK amp (the one with the canbus connection) my odometer starts flashing indicating an proxi misalignment. Not a problem for me as I have cut the wires I need but if someone with a HK amp is planning on doing this and buying the plugs as Unique did then they will need to find out what else needs changing with a proxi alignment.
I started carrying out a basic tune then my car went mental. I soon realised this was due to my battery going flat even though I had my car connected to my trickle charger. Perhaps it wasn't connected properly, or just couldn't keep up with all the works I was carrying out over the weekend and maybe Alfa had my ignition on playing music whilst in the workshop (which would normally be OK if i didn't have 3 big amps in the boot). All charged up now and all errors cleared so hopefully do a bit more tuning tonight or try and get those tweeters out again.

Can you clarify that when you were doing this testing it was on the ETM output while in base audio mode? Thanks!

 

[dananton485]

Can you clarify that when you were doing this testing it was on the ETM output while in base audio mode? Thanks!

Well that part was not me.

I don't know if this helps but I will send this out anyway. I can only speak of the Base audio system for the Guilia as that is what I have. I used the 40-pin Fakra extension adaptor to tap into the speaker outputs of the ETM. The quality of the outputs is great - I use the Audio Control LC1 and LC2 Pro with the built-in load adaptor switch set to 20ohms to avoid dash lights. I ran the speaker wires from my aftermarket amps back through the adapter to reach the factory door locations. The rear doors have the Morel Maximo components which had a much smaller crossover unit that I was able to install inside the rear door also the factory tweeter is in the rear door panel by default so I swapped that for the Morel tweeter. The front door is a different approach, I had to split off the front outputs from my passive crossover of the front components and wire them directly to the tweeter dash location (Front door components have a very large morel Virtus crossover that is located in the trunk). The mid-bass low pass from the Morel Virtus crossover I sent directly back through the Fakra extension adaptor which sent the signal to the midbass in the front doors. I disconnected the factory tweeter wire in the dash (BTW the tweeter does not set off the speaker dash light) and as I mentioned before the highpass from my competent crossover is running directly to the dash tweeter.

 

[loheiman]

Internal amplifier outputs has to have resistors. Without those ETM detects "OMG, I cannot detect speakers"-error and associated error messages are being shown in the dash. Some DSP's have internal resistors, which you can enable. Those should also work fine.

~ 20 ohm resistors are good; no point of having less than that. These work well:

View attachment 99651

AC-LGD 20 - AudioControl

Shares Facebook Twitter 5 Pinterest Google+

www.audiocontrol.com

Are resistors required for all modes of the ETM including base audio mode (not line driver) when hooked up to an aftermarket amplifier? Thanks

 

[populus]

....Sorry

 

[populus]

I can confirm that byte 112 controls the Amplifier / Line driver mode:

Byte 112: ETM Line driver mode / amplifier mode toggle. Value 0x00 = Amplifier Mode. Value 0x20 = Line Driver Mode

Byte 112 value 0x20
When the value is 0x20 ETM works in "Line driver / OEM Amplifier mode". In this mode the speaker detection is off, Volume control only works through external amplifier - fixed volume signal is sent to the OEM Amplifier and only in two channels. Other two channels are used to sent navigation messages and warning tones. Mixing of these signals happens on the amplifier and volume control, balance and fader are performed on OEM amplifier based on CANBUS signals.

You have to have an original OEM amplifier (either Intermediate - ASK Group or Harman Kardon) for this mode to make sense.

Byte 112 value 0x00
When the value is 0x00 ETM works in "Internal amplifier / Base audio mode". In this mode the speaker detection is on (you have to have resistors on outputs to avoid error messages; if resistors are not there you get audio system unavailable-error although everything works), Volume control on ETM works for the speaker outputs and navigation and warning tones are mixed to the outputs already on ETM. Basically this mode is the Base audio mode - it works exactly how the Base audio systems work.

Therefore, if you want to install new non-OEM amplifier without using Fix-82 or other solutions to "re-mix" the audio signals for external amplifier, you want to use this mode. The benefit of avoiding remixing is better sound quality, since OEM D-class amplifier on the signal path with remixing DSP is not doing good for the quality of audio.

About the bytes 31 & 47 you don't need to worry, these values will change to 0x00 when the OEM amplifier is removed.

In summary
This is the amplifier upgrade solution for all of you who want to upgrade Intermediate or HK amplifier to something else. You want to use this to simplify you installation and to get better sound quality. Having multiple non-necessary amplifiers and DSP's on your signal path is never good for the sound quality.

Order the harnesses mentioned in the previous post, built your own harness with these, install the amplifier, run proxi alignment and enjoy. Remember that before you change the proxi byte, the volume coming out from the ETM is at maximum. Just to avoid any loud surprises.

Good morning to "Unique" and all forumers, I'm Italian and I have a MY2022 Giulia Q4 280hp veloce and HK amplification, i apologize in advance for imprecise English (I use Google Translate). I've been following this discussion for some time, wanting to improve audio system (poor even if HK) I need some clarification:
If I want to insert a new amplification, ( for example Audison Prima AP8.9 bit) also changing all speakers( for example Hertz or other), do I have to change proxy via multiecuscan, since discussion dates back to a few years ago , are there any updates on the change of proxi byte ( and other updates) or does everything remain as before?
I await your replies.

 

[dananton485]

Okay, I'm not sure but I've heard that the radio units are all the same but they are configured differently in the computer. To change it you would need multiscan software, the proper cables and an SGW bypass plug. This would be the ultimate way to do a total HK audio system upgrade. I would think the preferred way to add an amp on the HK system would be to go to the car computer via multiscan turn the mode from preamp to speaker output mode. This essentially changes the factory head unit to the base audio system output (speaker level outputs). See this posting about the details. https://www.giuliaforums.com/threads/one-place-stereo-upgrade-options.32073/post-839850

Also you would need a good speaker level Line output converter(s) like the Audio Control LC1, and LC2i Pro that has the built in ohm load switch to avoid the dash light this is confirmed to work) Once you do that you should have speaker level outputs. Under this scenario you would need the appropriate line output converters I mentioned earlier and running all the speaker wire directly from your amp to the appropriate speakers.

A much simpler alternative approach would be to keep your HK system in its current mode and just upgrade the subwoofer and an after market amp for the subwoofer only. This can be done by tapping the speaker wires leading to the factory subwoofer on the rear dash and running those to your LOC and then amp. You can replace the 6x9 with an upgraded one and run it as a sub or you can get a nice 6.5" subwoofer or 8" subwoofer and run it free air off the rear deck. You will need to make a custom baffle to mount the speaker from the trunk but that is not so difficult. Power connections to the battery are also easy as ground and power connections are available in the trunk. Those who have done this with the 6 x 9 have later done an 8" woofer and seemed to be happier with the results. Yes I know this is an older post but I figure someone might end up here reading it.

 

[Theycallmebritish]

"Internal amplifier / Base audio mode" will eliminate my rear deck sub?
I have Focal Speakers front and rear with the front tweeters. Also have a Rockford 10Inch in the back powered in box amp.
I'm trying to connect a JL Audio 4 channel amp to power the four speakers (crossover for tweeters) but Not sure how to wire this harness. Thank you for your time.

 

[Theycallmebritish]

It has an input and output, and is a passive device, so no need for power.
"Parts Express 100 Hz Low Pass 4 Ohm Crossover" from www.parts-express.com!

https://www.parts-express.com/pedocs/tech-diagrams/266-444--crossover--schematic.pdf

Does this help with the sound because ive used a harness to plug into the 6x9 rear deck speaker wire, then fed the wire from harness to a resistor, then wires from resistor to the high level input of the amp. Tanks mate