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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Had a great day today tracking. M3s are too easy to beat. But did finally run into something really fast . A 700hp Katech Corvette which is really amazing if you look up that car. They turn the motor into a 427 and make it very great track car, even has DSC controls for the shocks. Does not overheat either. My favorite Corvette so far.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forum...-na-katech-427-lt1-grand-sport-track-car.html

We had some great rallies really competitive! Later on he got faster and we were about tied, but he had racing slicks and I had street tires on.

But the competition made me drive faster than I ever have and I beat my previous record by almost 4 seconds on this track. Also two seconds faster than I've done it with my 4C so felt really good about my driving.
https://youtu.be/UZdGILGD3oA
https://youtu.be/T6i5Oxszd_s
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I wish I had the guts to track my QV. What was your top speed on the longest straightway, and how much tire wear do you have from a single day at the track?
Car is amazing on the track it's really fun too so if you want to do it just go and do it in B group and tell the officials this is your first time and that will take good care of you. And then just discipline yourself to drive very mellow and safely and you really do have a little risk. Main thing is to just stay away from other drivers and watch for stuff that might get thrown on the road if somebody goes off course.

I have hit 150mph before maybe a bit more I haven't checked this last session but that's about all I would do on street tires. This track is a bit rough with not good off course. I think one of my videos shows a guy spin out at the end of the big straightaway he almost lost it but did save it. I guarantee you that woke him up!!!

We had the Gold Rush Rally come through town here a few months ago and I was part of it with my 4C and The group came to this SCR road course track and a McLaren got up to 168mph in that same straightaway. That is a very expense nice track car with very good tires and get aero. And a few motorcycles tell me they get up to about that same speed but that would be the craziest ones so not sure I believe it ha ha.

I am putting Eibach lowering springs on my Giulia along with an EC ECU tune and Remus exhaust that will get me up to about 630hp. And I'll probably put some Hoosier racing slicks and racing wheels on the car too. With those power and safety additions I bet I get to 160mph but I really enjoyed turns much better than super high-speeds. With those mods the Giulia should be an even more amazing beast at the track!

Stock tires don't last long at all on the street or track. I suspect most QV owners with the soft Pirelli tires are only going to get 5,000 to 10,000 street miles. If you go to the track and drive hard like I do you could get rid of those tires in one or two days! But I found some really good tires they're a great compromise for the track and also get some real street miles behind them. The new Michelin Pilot Sport 4S (300 hardness)
Ft 265/35/19 rear 26.3" tall (+.5")
Rear 305/30/19 26.3" tall (+.5")
Yes I put them on oversize and no they do not rub and they handle better last longer, look better and offer some parking curb rim protection. I estimate I'll get 5 to 8 for full hard track days out of these tires but I drive quite hard, Most other people that track cars would get more.

Brakes are another story if you track your car you'll probably only get about 8-10 full track days out of a set of CCB front brake pads. Doesn't matter a whole lot if standard or carbon ceramic you'll get about the same amount of days . What the carbon ceramics give you is maybe 25% longer brake pad life at track and you can brake harder and longer and you have quite a bit less unsprung weight which helps helps handling. I'm already looking at buying my first set or front brake pads at over $1300 for my Giulia as it has the CCB. So tracking a Giulia with CCB is more expensive, maybe double or more. And I don't know how much longer the CCB rotors last than steel ones but that would add some more into it too as they cost maybe 4 times as much of steel rotors and you have to be much more careful with them when changing tires as to not drop the wheel on the rotor and chip it.

Bottom line is tracking any heavy car (over 2,800 lbs) is expensive on consumables. That is why my main tracking car is the 4C. The price on consumables is only 25% of the cost of the Giulia. Plus it's a lightweight mod engine car which is incredible for handling. My 4C is quite modded and is very fast even faster than the Giulia but not by much.

But Giulia is an amazing track car too and if you don't track it superhard you can make it reasonablly priced. And some people just track their car two or three times a year. When I get my 4C back that's the car I will track most all the time.

It's a real rush I'm exhausted after tracking. I wish I would've had a good quality video of the session where me and that modded black Vette went at it. That was absolutely amazing I felt like I was a professional racecar chasing a competitor for first place in some huge race. I really pushed myself in my car and knocking four seconds off my best lap time is quite a feat, it is a gulf.
But I built myself up to going this hard over a year taking it slow and keeping it in dynamic mode. I've never spun out got off course her anything dangerous and I attribute that to going out it slowly and building up. Problem with tracking hard in Giulia in dynamic mode is that it where's your tires and brakes even more than race mode. But you do have that safety factor that will keep you from spinning out and potentially wrecking your car. So it's a real balance but if you find yourself tracking really hard in dynamic mode you might switch to race mode and kick it down several speed notches and build up your speed again SLOWLY.
Now I drive hard in race mode in every car and it is a whole different level and I have a long way to go. Smooth, relaxed and consistent is the key.

Also I watch my videos several times and look for correction and learn lots of things. Also helps get through the winter off track season.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Did you manage to data log all of the information such as temps, pressures, Gs, and all of that good track stuff?
No I was just using an inexpensive TrackAddict iPhone app and on bumper video was a Sony action cam.

In my 4C I have a high tech system, the Vbox HD2 System that does all of that but I don't even look at the data yet I have to learn it this winter it takes some time to figure out how to read it and I'm busy at my work.

But watching the temperature of the car never got hot. The ATV (automatic torque vectoring) light came on once after a hard session but after about only 10 minutes of car cooling it went out. Car is quite reliable in race mode. If you track it hard and dynamic mode it puts extra stress on the car and you can have some extra cooling issues or codes pop up. Also don't track hard with less than half a tank a gas as if the car has some fast elevation changes it can trigger some codes to put it into natural mode. That happened to me last time I went out but I carry a code tracking device and I just quickly cleared the code and it was good again but I had to refill the gas tank to keep the codes from coming back over those same elevations.
 

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We had the Giulia Qv out on our local track yesterday driven by one of our fastest Porsche drivers.

The QV is very quick. It was being driven quite a bit harder than Al's car and could pretty much keep up with the quickest GT4 on the day for 4-5 laps. After that the brakes went a bit soft and front tyres started to overheat causing understeer. Out of the box hugely impressive times. By way of example 991 GT3 demo car on Trofeo R driven by Earl Bamber (LeMans WEC winner 2015/2017) Nov 2016 lap time 1.37.63 and Giulia QV best lap 1.41.63. However.....

The car was 3 weeks old and had done 2000 miles. The front pads (steel rotors) were down to wear sensors by end of third session! The front shoulders of the Corsa AR tyres were seriously scrubbed out having lost the tread pattern for the first inch of the shoulder. The next two bars in were tappered entirely to the base. Those tyres would not have lasted more than 6 x 20 min sessions on our track. Its a 2.3 mile track and very technical with alot of tight corners. The front right hand rotor (anti clockwise track so RHS of car taking the most punishment) was fully clogged with brake dust within 2 sessions and showing heat stress through the annular by end of third session). Apart from brake sensor warning no issues, fuel was kept above 1/4 tank. Car had to retire after 3 x 20 min sessions (first session was damp so more like 2.5 x dry sessions equivalent). Rear tyres, rotors and pads showed only light wear...

Car was driven in Dynamic mode first session wet then Race mode manual shift next two sessions dry.

CONCULSION: If the QV is driven in stock trim by a driver of close to semi pro skill the car will not make a full day on stock tyres and pads. The front steel rotors would be lucky to last 2-3 track days!!

In order for this car to be used for track work even on an occassinal bases (3-4 times a year) you would need to make the following changes IMO:

1). Upgraded front pads. There are no real options I can see right now only Hawk. Please direct me if Im wrong? I think it will be 6-12 months before we get some better options like RS29 or RT RE10 or Ferrodo DS2500.

2). Upgrade brake fluid to Castrol SRF or similar (better temp management)

3). Here is the one I think needs addressing regardless of CCB or Steel - the car is in desperate need of brake ventilation. There is no ventilation I can see for the front of the car. all the vents at the front are for radiators and/or to reduce pressure (aero). The car needs at minimum some scoops that ziptie to the underside of bottom suspension arms to get some air into the rotor area.

I will post some pictures and footage in the next few days.

CCB rotors according to the European Epar parts system are around 10x moire expensive a set and pads 2.5x more a set than steel. I assume same will be true for USA. Al, I would consider making brake ventilation mods as soon as you can to extend life of your CCB rotors. As you get faster in this car you will take more material off of them. Have them weighted after your next track day and see how much you have used.

I spend alot of time at the track in 991 GT3, 981 GT4. We run these cars very hard and many of us also race in series. PCCB are too expensive/fragile for track use so NONE of us use them. Anyone who buys cars with them takes them off before the track and fits the steel rotors. More pad and rotor choice (i.e. Racebrakes etc).

Here is the screen shot from Alfa system. Replacement CCB are 20K Euro including tax for 4 rotors! By comparison steel are 2K Euro. Thats 23K USD vs 2.3K USD. Check with your local Alfa dealer to be sure....I would suggest your replace rotors with steel and use alternative pads ideal for steel (at this time limited).

The bottom line is that the Alfa QV driven hard is a very quick car, able to put in times similar to a GT4 or an older GT3 on a tight track driven by similar skill level (moderate/high). However its not a robust product for repeated track work without big $$$ expenditure. Tyres are a real problem (only -0.5 degrees front camber from factory not adjustable) and the factory fit tyres are as soft as butter. Brake ventilation is non existent (affecting pad and rotor life and transferring heat to fluid) and factory pads are not up to the temps needed to haul 2800 don at negative 1 g on track...
 

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No I was just using an inexpensive TrackAddict iPhone app and on bumper video was a Sony action cam.

In my 4C I have a high tech system, the Vbox HD2 System that does all of that but I don't even look at the data yet I have to learn it this winter it takes some time to figure out how to read it and I'm busy at my work.

But watching the temperature of the car never got hot. The ATV (automatic torque vectoring) light came on once after a hard session but after about only 10 minutes of car cooling it went out. Car is quite reliable in race mode. If you track it hard and dynamic mode it puts extra stress on the car and you can have some extra cooling issues or codes pop up. Also don't track hard with less than half a tank a gas as if the car has some fast elevation changes it can trigger some codes to put it into natural mode. That happened to me last time I went out but I carry a code tracking device and I just quickly cleared the code and it was good again but I had to refill the gas tank to keep the codes from coming back over those same elevations.
Just to be clear the codes are from the 4C or from the Q?
 

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...The bottom line is that the Alfa QV driven hard is a very quick car, able to put in times similar to a GT4 or an older GT3 on a tight track driven by similar skill level (moderate/high). However its not a robust product for repeated track work without big $$$ expenditure. Tyres are a real problem (only -0.5 degrees front camber from factory not adjustable) and the factory fit tyres are as soft as butter. Brake ventilation is non existent (affecting pad and rotor life and transferring heat to fluid) and factory pads are not up to the temps needed to haul 2800 don at negative 1 g on track...
What is this port for? I had always thought it was for brake cooling.
 

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Kraig. I think its for Aero to relieve pressure behind front fender. I have removed both front wheel inner liner. The liner has a vented front to it but doesn't direct air to brakes. Is simply there to relive "lift" pressure I believe with the exit port being the grill on the front fender below the clover insignia. When I was under the car with the wheels and liner off I cant recall seeing anything that would help cool the brakes but I could be wrong as it was a few weeks ago and I wasnt looking for it (I was carrying out the brake sensor wire plug TSB).
 

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Engine thermal management was very good on the track. At no time did the oil get seriously hot. In Race mode I think the secondary fan turns on early. The ATV warning never came up either...
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
We had the Giulia Qv out on our local track yesterday driven by one of our fastest Porsche drivers.

The QV is very quick. It was being driven quite a bit harder than Al's car and could pretty much keep up with the quickest GT4 on the day for 4-5 laps. After that the brakes went a bit soft and front tyres started to overheat causing understeer. Out of the box hugely impressive times. By way of example 991 GT3 demo car on Trofeo R driven by Earl Bamber (LeMans WEC winner 2015/2017) Nov 2016 lap time 1.37.63 and Giulia QV best lap 1.41.63. However.....

The car was 3 weeks old and had done 2000 miles. The front pads (steel rotors) were down to wear sensors by end of third session! The front shoulders of the Corsa AR tyres were seriously scrubbed out having lost the tread pattern for the first inch of the shoulder. The next two bars in were tappered entirely to the base. Those tyres would not have lasted more than 6 x 20 min sessions on our track. Its a 2.3 mile track and very technical with alot of tight corners. The front right hand rotor (anti clockwise track so RHS of car taking the most punishment) was fully clogged with brake dust within 2 sessions and showing heat stress through the annular by end of third session). Apart from brake sensor warning no issues, fuel was kept above 1/4 tank. Car had to retire after 3 x 20 min sessions (first session was damp so more like 2.5 x dry sessions equivalent). Rear tyres, rotors and pads showed only light wear...

Car was driven in Dynamic mode first session wet then Race mode manual shift next two sessions dry.

CONCULSION: If the QV is driven in stock trim by a driver of close to semi pro skill the car will not make a full day on stock tyres and pads. The front steel rotors would be lucky to last 2-3 track days!!

In order for this car to be used for track work even on an occassinal bases (3-4 times a year) you would need to make the following changes IMO:

1). Upgraded front pads. There are no real options I can see right now only Hawk. Please direct me if Im wrong? I think it will be 6-12 months before we get some better options like RS29 or RT RE10 or Ferrodo DS2500.

2). Upgrade brake fluid to Castrol SRF or similar (better temp management)

3). Here is the one I think needs addressing regardless of CCB or Steel - the car is in desperate need of brake ventilation. There is no ventilation I can see for the front of the car. all the vents at the front are for radiators and/or to reduce pressure (aero). The car needs at minimum some scoops that ziptie to the underside of bottom suspension arms to get some air into the rotor area.

I will post some pictures and footage in the next few days.

CCB rotors according to the European Epar parts system are around 10x moire expensive a set and pads 2.5x more a set than steel. I assume same will be true for USA. Al, I would consider making brake ventilation mods as soon as you can to extend life of your CCB rotors. As you get faster in this car you will take more material off of them. Have them weighted after your next track day and see how much you have used.

I spend alot of time at the track in 991 GT3, 981 GT4. We run these cars very hard and many of us also race in series. PCCB are too expensive/fragile for track use so NONE of us use them. Anyone who buys cars with them takes them off before the track and fits the steel rotors. More pad and rotor choice (i.e. Racebrakes etc).

Here is the screen shot from Alfa system. Replacement CCB are 20K Euro including tax for 4 rotors! By comparison steel are 2K Euro. Thats 23K USD vs 2.3K USD. Check with your local Alfa dealer to be sure....I would suggest your replace rotors with steel and use alternative pads ideal for steel (at this time limited).

The bottom line is that the Alfa QV driven hard is a very quick car, able to put in times similar to a GT4 or an older GT3 on a tight track driven by similar skill level (moderate/high). However its not a robust product for repeated track work without big $$$ expenditure. Tyres are a real problem (only -0.5 degrees front camber from factory not adjustable) and the factory fit tyres are as soft as butter. Brake ventilation is non existent (affecting pad and rotor life and transferring heat to fluid) and factory pads are not up to the temps needed to haul 2800 don at negative 1 g on track...
Interesting stuff and you have a lot of knowledge thanks. I agree with most everything you say with only a few minor different opinions.

The two videos I provided were my normal 8 out of 10 driving skill intensity and I certainly was pushing the car hard. But one thing I'm pretty sure about no one drove that Giulia car harder than I was driving it against that black modded Vette. I've been tracking pretty hard for a while now but I've never driven any car harder than that in session. It was extremely intense and it was all I could do is keep up with him but I couldn't pass him and I was trying every trick up my sleeve. I was driving at least 9/10 of my ability.

Unfortunately the Sony actioncam battery died and I didn't record that hard session with the Vette. But I did record it with my TrackAddict app on my iPhone. But unfortunately the exposure pretty much ruined the picture. But here's a video of 3 of the 8 laps we had in that session. There's no exposure setting in this inexpensive iPhone app and I'll never put it behind me again its exposure works pretty good if you put in the front window. But I think you might be able to sense the intensity. Also you can watch the G force meter. Note the inner ring is 1G and outer ring is 2G

After this session I was exhausted and didn't even finish the whole track day after that. I went out one more time but it just wasn't fun anymore after the battle I had with that Vette. Stick a fork in me I'm done lol!!

https://youtu.be/mrh33d682L4

Those stock Pirelli tires are only 60 hardness and yes you could blow the front tires up in one hard track day. And that's exactly what I did, one day and the fronts were gone. The rears will probably last three or four track days but I took them off when I switch tires. But again my car was stuck in natural mode for that tracking session which definitely caused excessive wear on the tires and brakes.

I tried some expensive Sport Cup 2 that are 180 hardness but only got three long track days out of them. But I was smoking the tires going up some hills and doing some drifting and goofing off. Now that I've settled down I think I found the perfect tire for tracking that's also affordable the
Michelin Pilot Sport 4S (300 hardness)
Ft 265/35/19 rear 26.3" tall (+.5")
Rear 305/30/19 26.3" tall (+.5")

I have two good hard track days on them and they still look great. I estimate they will last five or six hard track days with daily driving in between which is not bad for a heavy car. And this model is not that expensive.

Brakes, I wish the CCB brake pads were only 2.5x the cost of steel pads. I just ordered a set and my discounted price was $1,350 for a front set only. Whereas steel ones are about $250 I believe. But I was told by an Alfa vendor the front rotors are about $4,000-5,000 for a set which is not bad for CCB. I'm going to check the real price next week and all hope that I'm right in what I heard.

And as you know Porsche charges a lot more for their parts versus Alfa. Also as I'm sure you know front brakes are what goes out and the rears seem to last a whole lot longer.

Real question is how long will the front brakes last. My experience so far is skewed as my car was stuck in natural mode and I went tracking with it and all those nannies really wear out the brakes and tires. I also feel dynamic about also wears them out but to a lesser extent. I've noticed a big improvement in consumables driving in race mode only on the track. But I don't recommend that to anyone unless they're ready for it.

Also how long will the CCB rotors last for someone who tracks the car is a good question. I should be a good example to look at in the next year. Until then I'll hope for the best and what I reading some articles that doesn't work too good for people to track hard. Here's one interesting article and part of it says:

"This feature means that the wear resistance of Carbon Ceramic Material guarantees an approximate disc life of 150,000 km (93,000 miles) *for road use and 2,000 km (2,400 miles) for extreme track use (e.g. Ferrari Challenge),? Michelini said."

https://www.google.com/amp/www.auto...dnt-upgrade-to-carbon-ceramic-brakes.html/amp

I am on my third set of tires now with only 2,000 miles on my car but about 700 of those miles are tracking miles. And my brakes are almost one out too. But again because I tracked in natural mode I think my experience is skewed.

I have a 4C and I love that car because the consumables are almost nothing compared to the Giulia. But from what I hear from Corvette,Z28 and also Porsche people they spent quite a bit on tires and brakes too. That's what makes the 4C such a good deal it can compete or beat all of these cars and get by for less than half the consumables cost.

One good thing about CCB brakes is much less brake dust and I'm not sure you have to worry about adding cooling ducts with the carbon fiber rotors as they dissipate and handle heat so much better.

For handling improvement when I put my Eibach springs it's going to do quite a bit to help the car. It will lower the car which will add static negative camber and that should bring the total camber to about -1. Plus it'll be easier on the car for brakes and everything as it won't bounce around so much between acceleration and braking. So that's my plan.

I totally agree it's not the best track car but I kind of feel all heavy cars are like that. It's possible that new Giulia you saw was also driven crazy hard like I drove mine at first and that it also had a lot of premature wear. And I really feel tracking the car hard in natural or dynamic mode is not a good idea as it really wears out brakes and tires exponentially.

I'll know whole lot more in six months. I'm hoping it will be reasonable. And I really don't plan on tracking this car a whole lot anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
No I was just using an inexpensive TrackAddict iPhone app and on bumper video was a Sony action cam.

In my 4C I have a high tech system, the Vbox HD2 System that does all of that but I don't even look at the data yet I have to learn it this winter it takes some time to figure out how to read it and I'm busy at my work.

But watching the temperature of the car never got hot. The ATV (automatic torque vectoring) light came on once after a hard session but after about only 10 minutes of car cooling it went out. Car is quite reliable in race mode. If you track it hard and dynamic mode it puts extra stress on the car and you can have some extra cooling issues or codes pop up. Also don't track hard with less than half a tank a gas as if the car has some fast elevation changes it can trigger some codes to put it into natural mode. That happened to me last time I went out but I carry a code tracking device and I just quickly cleared the code and it was good again but I had to refill the gas tank to keep the codes from coming back over those same elevations.
Just to be clear the codes are from the 4C or from the Q?
Yes the Giulia of course. The 4C has no ATV. And you do not need a clear any codes for when the ATV light comes on. It just need a little time to cool down. Codes came on because the car sensed a possible starvation of fuel that you never want on any turbo charged motor and also traction control nannies put extra stress on the car which can cause ATV to get hot.
 

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Thanks

@Macca...appreciate the insight...2 things that surprise me a little..(and my car has been tracked twice so far, but not as intensely)..
lack of brake cooling duct work...never looked for it...just assumed they allowed for it...and the fact that the suspension geometry up front does not allow for any camber adjustment whatsoever?......
pads, fluids is SOP......
 

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Hi Al.

Good idea to check those CCB prices. I spoke with my dealer today and suspect you'll be A bit shocked. Post their quote when you have it.

It would be good if you could PM me your supplier for the pads. $250 is way cheaper than here!

Also learnt that upgrading fluid is uneccessary. Hydraulic circuit only back up for brake by wire failure so not needed.

It's impossible to compare track times between different drivers on different tracks. I'll post the video when it's done so you can judge. Here is a lap I did in my GT3 of the same circuit few months ago to give you an idea. There's plenty in my channel. Earl Bamber did a reference lap in the same car, I've been chasing it ever since! Got there in the end and put the car up for sale that evening lol. Earl probably left some on the table. He signed the hood but I didn't get more for the car lol!


As I said very impressed with Giulia handling and pace yesterday. Driver is a talented wheelman and smooth - I've had over 6000 km track battles with the guy and led him with my GT4 so I could see the QV in my mirror.

The QV did a best lap 1.41.63 in its third session casing my GT4. Earl did a late 37 in a991 GT3 on Trofeo R and has won lemans twice. This is also a track he has driven lots. 4s difference - not bad. 991 Cup car record here last years Porsche series winner 1.29.33 on michi slicks blue. I think there was another 1s a lap by day end if the QV could have gone the distance....pretty impressive.

But it's not set up from factory for this work. A brand new set of pads in Sixty track miles! Front RS rotor stress cracks. Calipers changed colour permanently all four corners a few shades darker red good old brembo Porsche ones used to do the same after a year or so on track. Front tyre shoulders were well gone and wouldn't have lasted three more twenty minute sessions....

Anyway. Great road car and awesome handling road car if you can deal with the track durability compromise...
 
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Anyway. Great road car and awesome handling road car if you can deal with the track durability compromise..
Or, as I guess you are suggesting, you can buy a GT4 for 2x$$.
The Q4 is a four door sedan, one would expect to spend some upgrade money to make it a viable car for the track.
 

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I suspect a good track setup both tires and fluids wise are the following

Bridgestone RE71R (Available in our size just can't do Top speed runs with these tires).
Castrol SRF Brake Fluid

I always thought the vents above the intercoolers were bract ducts. I guess not it seems ?
 

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The QV is very quick. It was being driven quite a bit harder than Al's car and could pretty much keep up with the quickest GT4 on the day for 4-5 laps. ...
The car was 3 weeks old and had done 2000 miles. The front pads (steel rotors) were down to wear sensors by end of third session! The front shoulders of the Corsa AR tyres were seriously scrubbed out having lost the tread pattern for the first inch of the shoulder.
That's impressive that a well driven QV can keep up with a well driven GT4 (vs. mediocre driven cars going faster than novice piloted cars), GT4s are pretty mental.

What pressures did you all set the tires to? I wonder if tire pressures can help offset the premature wear, I know it won't eliminate, but if it can help get another session, that's going in the right direction.. I'm not surprised by the pad wear though with the steel rotors -- Street pads tend to have accelerated wear when introduced to a ton of heat.

3). Here is the one I think needs addressing regardless of CCB or Steel - the car is in desperate need of brake ventilation. There is no ventilation I can see for the front of the car. all the vents at the front are for radiators and/or to reduce pressure (aero). The car needs at minimum some scoops that ziptie to the underside of bottom suspension arms to get some air into the rotor area.
I imagine some sort of downward facing duct (ie. NACA duct) that might be used to pull some air towards the brakes.

ie.


I spend alot of time at the track in 991 GT3, 981 GT4. We run these cars very hard and many of us also race in series. PCCB are too expensive/fragile for track use so NONE of us use them. Anyone who buys cars with them takes them off before the track and fits the steel rotors. More pad and rotor choice (i.e. Racebrakes etc).
The "come drive an exotic on a race track" experiences do the same. Interesting to see racers with CCBs doing it too.
 
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