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Discussion Starter #1
I have decided to bring back Steel Braided Brake lines we carried years ago. MADE IN GERMANY

Hoses comply with the US FMVSS 106 and DOT. Available in several colors. Will stock Stainless Steel and Black, other colors are special order.

Giulia/Stelvio and 4C will be stocked soon.

Benefits:
Exact pressure point
Best haptic
Less leverage needed
Shorter braking distance
Extremely resistant
"Almost" indestructible
TÜV and DOT approved
Fast delivery
Excellent service
*We don't charge extra for custom hoses

Technical details:
Manufactured in accordance to international EG-policies
Meets US FMVSS and DOT standards
High-strength aluminium- and stainless steel banjos
Plastic covered hoses upon requested
Original TEFLON® inner core (PTFE)
Tensile strength more than 240 Kp
Burst pressure 966 bar
Minimal bending radius 38mm
Diameter 3,2 x 6,2
Not flammable

Alfa Romeo's:
Giulia- 952/Stelvio (2.0L and 2.9L)
4C
164
156
166
145
146
155
105/115 and more....
101483


101484
 

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Do you have any substantiation of the performance improvement claims when installed on a Type 952 Guilia?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Do you have any substantiation of the performance improvement claims when installed on a Type 952 Guilia?
No measured data. No. This is all I will say.

Some people think that by upgrading to stainless steel brake lines they will be able to increase their caliper clamping pressure or brake torque. The truth of the matter is that a stainless steel brake line upgrade will only increase the brake fluid pressure vs volume relationship, and not the brake fluid pressure vs brake torque relationship.

By doing the upgrade, you will have effectively decreased the amount of time it takes to build up critical pressure in your brakes’ hydraulic system to activate your calipers at their maximum level. Pressure created in your hydraulic system will not be increased overall, it will simply take more brake pedal travel distance to effectively build that brake line pressure needed to fully activate your braking calipers. This results overall, in a more responsive brake pedal.

Basically it's not really improving things it's changing the feel and that is what most are feeling and thinking is an actual brake improvement over the OEM.

I prefer to state that these are more effective on the track as the modulation of the braking will possibly become more crisp. I am not going to say that these will perform some miracle on your braking system but can make the braking more responsive if that is what you are looking for, not that they are not responsive enough already.

The reason for offering these is mainly for the track crowd. Can be used on every day cars as well to allow for a different "feel" in the braking.

I can also say, guys with real track experience, either use them or they don't for various reasons. One big track guys who tracks a QV all the time claims they make a huge difference but of course there is no data in his opinion. I say it makes some difference, is that difference what you want and if it is, is it a positive improvement? Hard to say. I have use them in the past and they seemed to make some difference, with a BBW system it could well make the modulation of the braking system more concise more predictable.
 

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Any experience with them on a Giulia? Does it change the pedal feel even though we have the MK C1 "brake by wire"?
 

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No measured data. No. This is all I will say.

Some people think that by upgrading to stainless steel brake lines they will be able to increase their caliper clamping pressure or brake torque. The truth of the matter is that a stainless steel brake line upgrade will only increase the brake fluid pressure vs volume relationship, and not the brake fluid pressure vs brake torque relationship.

By doing the upgrade, you will have effectively decreased the amount of time it takes to build up critical pressure in your brakes’ hydraulic system to activate your calipers at their maximum level. Pressure created in your hydraulic system will not be increased overall, it will simply take more brake pedal travel distance to effectively build that brake line pressure needed to fully activate your braking calipers. This results overall, in a more responsive brake pedal.

Basically it's not really improving things it's changing the feel and that is what most are feeling and thinking is an actual brake improvement over the OEM.

I prefer to state that these are more effective on the track as the modulation of the braking will possibly become more crisp. I am not going to say that these will perform some miracle on your braking system but can make the braking more responsive if that is what you are looking for, not that they are not responsive enough already.

The reason for offering these is mainly for the track crowd. Can be used on every day cars as well to allow for a different "feel" in the braking.

I can also say, guys with real track experience, either use them or they don't for various reasons. One big track guys who tracks a QV all the time claims they make a huge difference but of course there is no data in his opinion. I say it makes some difference, is that difference what you want and if it is, is it a positive improvement? Hard to say. I have use them in the past and they seemed to make some difference, with a BBW system it could well make the modulation of the braking system more concise more predictable.
Thanks. I would be "all in" for anything that yields a measurable reduction in braking distance without any negative side-effects. Otherwise I'll leave it alone.
 

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There’s always the color aspect of the lines for those of you who love taking pics of the car every chance they get. 🤷🏻‍♂️ I see no difference in this than adding a CF mirror cover or Italian flag sticker on dash. @Alfissimo working hard here. Just introducing more products to the limited Alfa world. The more the merrier IMO. I respect it.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks. I would be "all in" for anything that yields a measurable reduction in braking distance without any negative side-effects. Otherwise I'll leave it alone.
I am not sure it does or does not as I have not personally measured anything and don't plan to. According to the "Guru" Tom who races a Giulia/Stelvio QV, they work. I'd say they do but in everyday driving probably not much just a slight different feel. Similar to a Pedal Tuner. Will help modulate the brake pedal better. I am marketing these more the track guys. In that realm there are those who use them and those who don't. I have used them before on alfa's with hydraulics and they seem to something. ;) I do not know yet the affects on BBW. You cannot rule out a slight change with BBW too.
 

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Is this personal experience, or just a guess?
I had SS brake lines on another car of mine and only installed them due to the old rubber ones cracking and didn't notice much difference. The Giulia is known for bad brake feel (it's better in race) so I have my reservations that SS lines will change any of that. I agree with the post above at least we now have more choice.
 

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I had SS brake lines on another car of mine and only installed them due to the old rubber ones cracking and didn't notice much difference. The Giulia is known for bad brake feel (it's better in race) so I have my reservations that SS lines will change any of that. I agree with the post above at least we now have more choice.
Interesting.

I've had SS brake lines on an Alfa 159 and liked it a lot.
At the moment I'm not super happy with the pedal feel on the Giulia, so I was asking for people who have already tried them...
 

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Non-SS brake lines have a very small expansion with braking, but will gradually have more when they get old and decrepit. SS lines transfer all the pedal/fluid pressure to the caliper and pads, losing none to "rubber" line expansion. So they can firm up the pedal feel, but ultimately since a little more pedal pressure will do the same with"rubber" lines, there would't be any shorter stopping difference. I have used SS lines on other cars in the past, esp when tracking them.

I suspect on a much newer Giula, the difference in pedal feel would be negligible. But as "rubber" lines age, in time, the pedal feel will remain the same with the SS lines, whereas the former will gradually swell, and thus change the pedal modulation. If the driver is really competent, then SS lines would I suspect be noticeably different than stock lines. And if one hits debris on the roadway, SS lines would be less likely to tear away, with the expected result.

When my QV needs its first brake flush, I think I will have them put on then. Inexpensive upgrade.

Just an opinion. NV
 

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The actual amount of movement of fluid in a brake line is very small. If the $$ braided lines need less you should get some reduction in time from pedal applied to pucks pressed into the rotor. The question is if that time is so minuscule as to be not measurable.

There are 3 ways to measure braking distance that I know:
1) Slam on the brakes and measure skid mark distance.
2) Drive past a marker and slam on the brakes. Measure marker to stopped vehicle distance.
3) Move a flag or turn on a light in front of the moving vehicle, measure vehicle positions when marker activated to vehicle stopped.

Only 1) is fully objective, but it excludes the braking system reaction time. 2) and 3) both include driver reaction times to some extent, making it difficult to impossible to get consistency.
From 60MPH a 0.1second reduction in braking system reaction time will yield a huge 8.8 foot reduction in braking distance. Even a meager 0.01 second reduction in braking system reaction time will yield nearly a 1 foot reduction. It is less clear what interaction there might be between an ABS system and hydraulic response times, since the ABS will cycle the pressure multiple times.

Of course with some added instrumentation you might be able to measure the vehicle position at the time the pedal is first touched. This would be more consistent than 2) but include the braking system reaction time unlike 1). There will be some variability in how aggressively the driver depresses the brake pedal but at least driver reaction time is removed from the measurement.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Non-SS brake lines have a very small expansion with braking, but will gradually have more when they get old and decrepit. SS lines transfer all the pedal/fluid pressure to the caliper and pads, losing none to "rubber" line expansion. So they can firm up the pedal feel, but ultimately since a little more pedal pressure will do the same with"rubber" lines, there would't be any shorter stopping difference. I have used SS lines on other cars in the past, esp when tracking them.

I suspect on a much newer Giula, the difference in pedal feel would be negligible. But as "rubber" lines age, in time, the pedal feel will remain the same with the SS lines, whereas the former will gradually swell, and thus change the pedal modulation. If the driver is really competent, then SS lines would I suspect be noticeably different than stock lines. And if one hits debris on the roadway, SS lines would be less likely to tear away, with the expected result.

When my QV needs its first brake flush, I think I will have them put on then. Inexpensive upgrade.

Just an opinion. NV
I agree. Won't be a much but some do claim there is a difference, a better response and modulation with SS lines. Under racing conditions is when they will be much more noticeable. These are not for everyone. I am offering them for those that want them but they were mainly for the track guys or guys that want something different. OEM brake lines are fantastic, expansion if any is very microscopic but there can be improvements with these lines.
 
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