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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
36k mile interval

8 hours flat-rate R&R

Grab a flashlight, look in the motor compartment and try to figure out how many layers of stuff must be removed.

Who will be the first to do a step by step tech write-up? (note: not covered under warranty)

 

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Wow, even if it was my daily driver I would top out at maybe 7500 miles annually. With that complex turbo system, I would not try and service it myself unless of course, the intercooler plumbing is simple once you get the plastic out of the way.
 

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Since I used to be a very hands on guy with my cars, I want to say i'll do it but odds are some independent shop I trust will get the job over an AR dealer. At leas then the cost of those 8 hours wont be so bad after all.
 

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36k mile interval

8 hours flat-rate R&R

Grab a flashlight, look in the motor compartment and try to figure out how many layers of stuff must be removed.

Who will be the first to do a step by step tech write-up? (note: not covered under warranty)


When my tech came back from training on the car he pointed out that this has to be the most stubbed designs he have ever seen except on the Ferrari's he has worked on. But hey it is a Ferrari designed engine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Most of the (major) service routine is:

Step 1- Remove drive-train

Dealers are getting "the Table" for dropping the drive-trains out of these cars. It is a hydraulically actuated lift table that has a bunch of alignment dowels.

At one of the Giulia launch parties I asked the service mgr if the drive-train table was able to be used on other RWD FCA cars. "Nope" No wonder dealer service costs are so high. The motor tables are thousands of dollars.
 

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Most of the (major) service routine is:

Step 1- Remove drive-train

Dealers are getting "the Table" for dropping the drive-trains out of these cars. It is a hydraulically actuated lift table that has a bunch of alignment dowels.

At one of the Giulia launch parties I asked the service mgr if the drive-train table was able to be used on other RWD FCA cars. "Nope" No wonder dealer service costs are so high. The motor tables are thousands of dollars.
You mean a glorified tranny jack or engine hoist? The 348, 355 and TRs had the engine on a sub frame. 8 bolts or so and it was ready to come out. Plumbing on the other hand was a little more involved ;) On the 360, they got smart and installed access panels to the belts behind the seats. Totally flips the maintenance costs for the rear engined cars of the era. Belts easy, F1, tranny mounts and so forth not so much ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
You mean a glorified tranny jack or engine hoist? The 348, 355 and TRs had the engine on a sub frame. 8 bolts or so and it was ready to come out. Plumbing on the other hand was a little more involved ;) On the 360, they got smart and installed access panels to the belts behind the seats. Totally flips the maintenance costs for the rear engined cars of the era. Belts easy, F1, tranny mounts and so forth not so much ;)
yeap, it is glorified. Supposedly only 2 hours to drop the entire motor/trans. I think it would take me an entire weekend for the first time. Thankfully (hopefully!?) we won't need to do any major surgery any time soon!
 

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yeap, it is glorified. Supposedly only 2 hours to drop the entire motor/trans. I think it would take me an entire weekend for the first time. Thankfully (hopefully!?) we won't need to do any major surgery any time soon!

Just like this one, it is a Maserati Ghibli. The bench and adaptors Maserati charged me close to $15,000.00 for the whole set up.
 

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When my tech came back from training on the car he pointed out that this has to be the most stubbed designs he have ever seen except on the Ferrari's he has worked on. But hey it is a Ferrari designed engine.
What do you mean "stubbed design"? ?

Thanks
 

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36k seems very low for modern drive belts.

Does anyone have any info on the turbo plumbing - I read somewhere that Ferrari and Alfa share turbo that is going through the V of the engine but I don't see how that is implemented.
I thought the photos of the engine that I saw showed the turbos below standard exhaust manifolds, and it looks like the hoses are routed like most other twin turbo cars...

Thanks to anyone that has any info or pictures.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
36k seems very low for modern drive belts.

Does anyone have any info on the turbo plumbing - I read somewhere that Ferrari and Alfa share turbo that is going through the V of the engine but I don't see how that is implemented.
I thought the photos of the engine that I saw showed the turbos below standard exhaust manifolds, and it looks like the hoses are routed like most other twin turbo cars...

Thanks to anyone that has any info or pictures.
The latter is correct. Legacy turbo location (not in the "V")
 

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The accessory drive belt service does look complicated.
Here's another one. Valve cover gaskets on the 2.9 Quad.
Since the valve cover incorporates the upper camshaft bearing cap, the pressure on the cam gear must be released before the valve cover can be removed. To do that, you must remove the timing chain cover and remove the timing chain. Since the timing chain is located at the rear of the engine block, you have to remove the engine. Yikes!
 

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so Ferrari does away with engine out services on the new ones...and pass it along to Alfa Quad owners???...LOL
I wonder if this information is 100% accurate?...and if it truly is as posted here...IF people would have known this prior would they still have purchased the car??
It is starting to sound like my brother's old RS6...
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
The major service seems to be the accessory belt on the Alfa 2.9T

The RS6-- that is whole 'nother animal. The timing belt service on those cars is 36k miles and an incredibly intricate process involving front-end removal for access, etc. The good news is that replacing a front? rear? (forget) 02 sensor in dealer flat-rate terms was: Step 1- Remove motor. Techs figured out a way to cheat the engine removal and creatively remove the O2 sensors in less than half the time.

I suspect the same creativity in wrenching for the Quadrifoglio will occur years down the road. Warranty is whole other process and the dealers must abide by the written service procedures. For example, the service of the rear end LSD is "remove and replace with new". Give it 5 years and an aftermarket shop will surely be selling re-build kits.

Same with the top end of the motor and valve train issues. Although the cam caps are built into the valve cover, there is a way to cheat the book-rate of removing the motor for chain rotation. Techs have figured this out on the Audi (T)FSI motors. Not sure why the Alfa Romeo 2.9T will be any different.
 

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Good Lord. This is making me think about a Ti. You could spend the engine out costs on a carbon QV hood swap.
 

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I am looking at the service manual and I don't see any indication that the engine needs to be pulled for the accessory belt replacement - maybe I'm missing something?

It says:

1) Disconnect and isolate the negative battery cable
2) Remove the Charge Air Cooler (CAC) and support bracket

and then immediately goes into compressing the belt tensioner, removing the belt, and replacing it…

Removing the intercoolers and brackets definitely doesn't look easy, but perhaps it is doable with the engine in place?
 
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