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Curious if you gave the EC P1 tune a hundred or so miles to allow the ECU to adapt?
I had well over 1,000 miles on the tune before I upgraded to phase 2. I only ran phase 1 due to not having an exhaust yet.
 

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Just an fyi, boost targets and timing targets should be met immediately. Transmissions shifting algorithms and fuel trims adapt iver time. Im always suspect of tuners who tell clients to give it 100 miles to feel power gains. It engages the placebo affect. Oh now i feel the power. Id ask the tuner why the ecu needs 100 miles to meet requested boost and timing targets.
+1

I have asked in the past and got no answer.
 

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Just an fyi, boost targets and timing targets should be met immediately. Transmissions shifting algorithms and fuel trims adapt iver time. Im always suspect of tuners who tell clients to give it 100 miles to feel power gains. It engages the placebo affect. Oh now i feel the power. Id ask the tuner why the ecu needs 100 miles to meet requested boost and timing targets.
Yes that is what I have experienced. When I applied the celtic tune, I could feel the difference in power, boost instantly. Once the fuel trims and transmission adapted, I could feel a bit more of a difference but this can be more positive or less depending on how you drive the car after flashing. For eg. if you drive slowly and in stop start stuff, the trims will be different to say driving spiritedly.

I think when people talk about ECU adaptation, they are actually talking about fuel trims not power/boost/timing.
 

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Discussion Starter #124
Yes that is what I have experienced. When I applied the celtic tune, I could feel the difference in power, boost instantly. Once the fuel trims and transmission adapted, I could feel a bit more of a difference but this can be more positive or less depending on how you drive the car after flashing. For eg. if you drive slowly and in stop start stuff, the trims will be different to say driving spiritedly.

I think when people talk about ECU adaptation, they are actually talking about fuel trims not power/boost/timing.
Exactly. Actually as the ecus get more advanced they get better and faster at adaptations not slower. You can log this on mes anyways. After you flash the ecu watch the first single run you make and youll see the boost and timing changes. Ive been doing pre and post comparisons on tunes since 2004 and even on the old bosch med7 units and up to the current mg1/md1 and simos 8.x and im sure our mm m10j is even better
 

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EC tells their customers to drive it like they stole it so the ECU adapts to quicker throttle mapping and more aggressive shift mapping... It's all sadly smoke and mirrors
 

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Discussion Starter #126
EC tells their customers to drive it like they stole it so the ECU adapts to quicker throttle mapping and more aggressive shift mapping... It's all sadly smoke and mirrors
That makes sense as far as "feel" is concerned and im sure there is shift and throttle logic learning but that wont make much difference in actual WOT acceleration but i can see them suggesting it for feel
 

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I had well over 1,000 miles on the tune before I upgraded to phase 2. I only ran phase 1 due to not having an exhaust yet.
If P1 was not delivering boost as it should, you should contact me to figure out what's going on.

EC tells their customers to drive it like they stole it so the ECU adapts to quicker throttle mapping and more aggressive shift mapping... It's all sadly smoke and mirrors
I think it's been made clear in the thousands of posts on our threads why we recommend this. It has nothing to do with encouraging "feel".

If you actually thought through what you posted ("drive it like they stole it so the ECU adapts to quicker throttle mapping and more aggressive shift mapping") instead of wanting to take a jab at us, you'd realize what a nonsensical statement that is. Especially with all that shift mapping we're doing.
 

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If P1 was not delivering boost as it should, you should contact me to figure out what's going on.



I think it's been made clear in the thousands of posts on our threads why we recommend this. It has nothing to do with encouraging "feel".

If you actually thought through what you posted ("drive it like they stole it so the ECU adapts to quicker throttle mapping and more aggressive shift mapping") instead of wanting to take a jab at us, you'd realize what a nonsensical statement that is. Especially with all that shift mapping we're doing.
I definitely would have contacted customer service, but It wasn't really a concern to me at the time since I knew Phase 1 was only temporary. I installed Phase 2 a couple days ago and that map shows much more significant results upon initial impressions. I still have to record long term data to test for consistency. It would be nice to have some numbers to compare to though. Burger Motorsports openly claims that the JB4 should add around 4-5psi, which I have actively witnessed to be true. However, I can't find numbers for the Eurocompulsion tunes that I can compare to, either because they aren't advertised or I just can't find them. So technically speaking, if the tune wasn't performing as intended, there would be no way for me to know.

User error always plays a factor as well.
 

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I definitely would have contacted customer service, but It wasn't really a concern to me at the time since I knew Phase 1 was only temporary. I installed Phase 2 a couple days ago and that map shows much more significant results.

User error always plays a factor.
No problem, that makes sense. If there's ever a need don't hesitate to reach out.

It's always a possibility that it may be an issue either with the device or this specific map, so I like to check things out.
 

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Discussion Starter #130
Correct. I have both active at the same time. There's a few reasons why I do it:

.....

4. The EC tune disables the rev limiter and limits traction control interference.

I think both systems compliment each other nicely. I do not really run ridiculous or unsafe numbers that would risk damaging anything.
Question about the sport traction control.... so did you order this option and what are your thoughts? Have a chance to test it at a track or in wet? This is very attractive to me as my esc cuts pretty aggressively poweering out of turns. The more torque the worse it has gotten of course

Mike
 

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With all do respect Toby, you have had years now to SHOW what your tunes are actually supposed to do. You have never offered any information. There have been numerous topics on this subject to do this in.

Sad fact is every set of data that has ever been posted by your customers show a rather lack of substantial enough changes to even come close to the gains EC claimed (be it data logs or acceleration times...), yet alone what can be gotten by a piggyback unit. Everytime I see "oh this must not be working, contact us".

How are your customers suppose to know if the tune is working if you never give them the info to let them prove it to themselves?

I would personally love to plop down $1k on a product that delivers on your claims - even remotely close to your claims. I sadly have never found a single case of an EC car outperforming other tuning options. Prove me wrong, I'd love it actually.
 

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Question about the sport traction control.... so did you order this option and what are your thoughts? Have a chance to test it at a track or in wet? This is very attractive to me as my esc cuts pretty aggressively poweering out of turns. The more torque the worse it has gotten of course

Mike
Well I've tried the Dynamic Traction control from EC tune and you can definitely tell it's allowing more slip and less intervention. There's no replacement for Race mode though; that's just fantastic. :D
 

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Discussion Starter #133
Well I've tried the Dynamic Traction control from EC tune and you can definitely tell it's allowing more slip and less intervention. There's no replacement for Race mode though; that's just fantastic. :D
I appreciate the feedback. I know i really want to do race mode but i have active suspension and i believe the race mod wii screw up both active suspension and throttle mapping modes... grrr.
 

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I appreciate the feedback. I know i really want to do race mode but i have active suspension and i believe the race mod wii screw up both active suspension and throttle mapping modes... grrr.
You can replace some module that is updated to handle the Race mode changes. CDCM module maybe? Alfissimo has them.
 

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Question about the sport traction control.... so did you order this option and what are your thoughts? Have a chance to test it at a track or in wet? This is very attractive to me as my esc cuts pretty aggressively poweering out of turns. The more torque the worse it has gotten of course

Mike
I can say that it is programed very intelligently. Wheel slip from a launch doesn't pull power anymore. I was driving in the rain a few days ago and I was able to spin my tires for a good 80 feet or so, but as soon as it detects any yaw, it will prevent you from sliding out.
 

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I can say that it is programed very intelligently. Wheel slip from a launch doesn't pull power anymore. I was driving in the rain a few days ago and I was able to spin my tires for a good 80 feet or so, but as soon as it detects any yaw, it will prevent you from sliding out.
That's a good observation, that's how it seems to react for me too.
 

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Discussion Starter #137
Hmmm. That seems nice. Do you think it would work allowing me to put power down out of a turn...allowing some lateral slip without cutting power?
 

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With all do respect Toby, you have had years now to SHOW what your tunes are actually supposed to do. You have never offered any information. There have been numerous topics on this subject to do this in.

Sad fact is every set of data that has ever been posted by your customers show a rather lack of substantial enough changes to even come close to the gains EC claimed (be it data logs or acceleration times...), yet alone what can be gotten by a piggyback unit. Everytime I see "oh this must not be working, contact us".

How are your customers suppose to know if the tune is working if you never give them the info to let them prove it to themselves?

I would personally love to plop down $1k on a product that delivers on your claims - even remotely close to your claims. I sadly have never found a single case of an EC car outperforming other tuning options. Prove me wrong, I'd love it actually.
It's due.

I disagree with your opinion overall, and especially the statement that we have never offered any information to customers. I feel that has been quite the opposite over years of being on this forum (I would argue we have offered as much as anyone else, if not more). You spend a lot of time saying our products do nothing, which I don't think is a fair or accurate assessment either.

Regardless, I'd rather just prove you wrong. There's a stock 2020 in the driveway, and I'll document all of the information on the car, as our testing needs to be updated for W05 as there's more there than just some turbo cooling updates. We'll see how it compares.
 

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There's a stock 2020 in the driveway, and I'll document all of the information on the car, as our testing needs to be updated for W05 as there's more there than just some turbo cooling updates. We'll see how it compares.
If it all possible Toby, I would appreciate figures based on your tune with no other modifications (i.e. no aftermarket exhaust or intake) for the Stage 1 at 91 Octane. This to me is the purest baseline that can be controlled; other things oftentimes cannot (air temperature, elevation, etc...).
 

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If it all possible Toby, I would appreciate figures based on your tune with no other modifications (i.e. no aftermarket exhaust or intake) for the Stage 1 at 91 Octane. This to me is the purest baseline that can be controlled; other things oftentimes cannot (air temperature, elevation, etc...).
Sounds good. That's what we have planned, so definitely will do.
 
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