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Okay so I got a question for all the quad owners, so I’ve been really considering buying this car and it’s between this, a bmw e92 m3 or Lexus rcf or gsf. The car checks all the boxes for me it’s newer, it’s fast as hell, and I can find with with low miles for a decent price. So the thing that’s been bothering me is most the ones I see the titles are “Lemon” and that’s what stopping me from really pulling the trigger. I’ve also saw other posts of people saying the reliability isn’t good. But I feel like that’s because some people beat the hell out of it, I hope that’s the reason why. But should I risk buying one with a lemon title? What are your thoughts.
 

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Okay so I got a question for all the quad owners, so I’ve been really considering buying this car and it’s between this, a bmw e92 m3 or Lexus rcf or gsf. The car checks all the boxes for me it’s newer, it’s fast as hell, and I can find with with low miles for a decent price. So the thing that’s been bothering me is most the ones I see the titles are “Lemon” and that’s what stopping me from really pulling the trigger. I’ve also saw other posts of people saying the reliability isn’t good. But I feel like that’s because some people beat the hell out of it, I hope that’s the reason why. But should I risk buying one with a lemon title? What are your thoughts.
Can you post some links to the lemon titled ones you are finding?
 

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The best way to handle any "should I buy it" questions, especially when comparing different brands, and older cars vs newer, is to put your butt in the seats and go drive them. Not just around the block, take it on the highway, hit some stop lights, drive it like you really plan on driving it (assuming you don't have a scared salesman with you).

We can't possibly know what's going to get your heart going, or what little things will stand out to you personally. I come from a long line of BMWs, but the second I drove a Giulia (not even spec'd how I wanted mine), I knew it was going to be my next car.

Mine is a lemon buyback and I have no regrets. The price was great, the issues were fixed, and I got a warranty with it.
 

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I come from a long line of BMWs, but the second I drove a Giulia (not even spec'd how I wanted mine), I knew it was going to be my next car.

Mine is a lemon buyback and I have no regrets. The price was great, the issues were fixed, and I got a warranty with it.
My story also. Test drove one in 2017 and knew it immediately. Took a risk on a lemon with a warranty and never looked back.
 

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I think all modern cars are incredibly complex, especially in their "electronics." The mechanical components of cars are quite reliable (and yes, those parts do sometimes fail in all cars), but it is usually the electrical systems which fail in all new cars. And can be tedious to diagnose, and fix. On our two new cars, one an '18 QV bought new, the other a Jaguar Pace SUV, we are still learning how to use their features, and if something doesn't seem to work, if it us us or the car's electrics. On my my wife's Pace, it took several trips to the dealer to have them successfully up date the Apple Play, which on my Alfa sometimes momentarily drops out. And we can never get the foot sweep under the Jag's rear bumper to open the hatch consistently. And even reading the owner's manual, thus far cannot get the electric hatch to let us adjust how high it will rise. Us or the car?

Long decades ago, when cars were simple, they died from rust, or worn mechanical parts. Now-a-days, discarded cars will be pristine with failed electronics.

If a person wants a vehicle to run "forever", get an older pick up, they go many hundreds of thousands of miles. My brother in law's 350K mile '95 Ford 150 is rusted out, but runs fine and does what he wants it to do. Of course, no radio or working windows, and jury rigged heating, & with no AC. But goes down the road pretty as you please. Well, actually, not so pretty, but makes it there and back.

On this and other forums, you will find owners like me, who at 19K miles love their trouble-free cars, and others who leave the brand out of frustration. Years ago it was said to never own a BMW out of warranty, for instance. My son's Porsche had a failed engine, and his new Toyota Sequoia dropped a valve. As for Alfa, I suspect they are neither better or worse than other brands, and some of that is just owner luck. As for buying a "lemon-buy-back", I think the law relates to how long and many times a repair was attempted and not whether the repair was finally resolved or not. So such a car could be fixed fine for its next owner, after the former owner was just too frustrated by the time and attempts to finally fully resolve the issue.

It just took three trips to the Mini dealer to finally fix a dash warning at start up on my daughter's Mini. Turned out Mini bulbs only give the ECU an "all clear" signal with Osram bulbs, with a brass tip, not an aftermarket bulb with a silver tip. Really? A silver tip on a working bulb throws an obscure code?

My daughter just bought a new Audi Q5, and with all the incredible features of her new car, she bought a long term warranty too. Just in case....

All the best....NV
 

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To me first is see if you have a good dealer nearby that can handle any issues or service (since its a lemon and possibly had multiple issues). My giulia was perfect until last weeks heat wave when it suddenly died in the middle of a busy interection on a 95F day w my 2 year old in it. No way for my vehicle to be put into neutral (w the electric shift mechnaism) to push off the side as well in the interection. 2018 model ( i bought new) w 2800 miles in 17 months of ownership. Im a hands on guy so i rarely bring a car in for repairs as i like to do it myself (also buy a multiecuscan) but with this car id recommend to have a few good dealer options.
 

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odd that your comparing 2 coupes (E92 & RCF) with the QV. really very different from many points.
I would discount the RCF unless you want the latest gizmo/tech in a car. doesn't hold a candle to the QV from any driving dynamic. The E92 is very different as well, it is a torque-less wonder for a V8 below 4k, the car loves to rev and needs too to get the most out of it. handling is very solid, car feels very planted & inspires confidence, much like the QV.
the QV hammers you back in your seat when you accelerate, power comes on very quickly, you find yourself shifting quickly. which brings me to the ZF, very impressed by how it shifts quickly & smoothly. IF rowing the boat is a deal breaker then you are getting the E92. but as someone said, you really need to drive the cars, and back to back would help greatly. Good Luck
 

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I believe that buying an Alfa Romeo is even much more simple than comparing it with a M3, S5, C63 or RCF/GSF. It is simply "I want to own an Alfa Romeo". That is the hiden fundamental difference between Alfa Romeo and BMW, Audi and Mercedes (and Lexus). You either own an Alfa Romeo or you own one of those popular and common nice cars that everybody has and that you can see by the dozens eveywhere. The QV specifically, is a Dream Car. Reliability wise, the QV is as good as or as bad as any of those sport cars. Buying a lemon car sounds risky but, as you read above, there are successful stories about that part, too.
 

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FWIW, I’ve had pretty good luck with my lemon titled QV. I haven’t had any issues that people without lemon titled cars have had. Make sure you look at the buyback paperwork so you can make sure the problems resulting in the buyback have been fixed. Even buying a new car is no guarantee you won’t have any issues. Just do your homework and take a mechanic (a good one) with you if you can. Just to be clear, if you want a car with 100% reliability and only visiting the dealer for oil changes, this is not going to be the car for you. Also when you drop it off for service be prepared to not get you car back for days or possibly weeks in some cases. If you can live with those possibilities you’ll probably be happy with it.
 

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when you buy a lemon-titled ANYTHING you assume certain risks, my advice to you is also to look at the Alfa dealer you will be buying? servicing the car from/with. That is the weak link in the Alfa chain, dealer network. Some are EXCEPTIONAL (like my service dealer, my selling, not so much) some are downright lousy to incompetent. Then there is the proximity factor, if you buy one and the closest dealer is over an hour away, be prepared to make that trip when necessary and not cry about it LOL. Let us know what you decide to go with and post pictures!
 

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You didn't say what your intentions are with the car, so I'm going to assume it's going to be a primary transportation. I've been a BMW guy for 10+ years at this point, but at this point, I would not recommend an E92 M3 unless it's a second or third car, only for bombing about on the weekends or something similar. Mainly, due to the fact that the newest E92 is seven-ish years old at this point, and it's going to be really hard, if not impossible, to find one that hasn't been flogged at least some during it's life. Combine that with the fact that it's out of warranty, and any M car can get somewhat expensive to run. They aren't unreliable, but they are high maintenance. I'm not saying you can't find one that's been taken care of and will be reliable and good to you, but I'm saying it's a bit less likely.

The V8 is lovely, but as stated above, a bit lazy at low RPM. It wants to rev, which is fine, because it's one of the most amazing sounding engines BMW has made. The car drives very well, and is a great sports car that still has plenty of practicality. You absolutely can daily it, as long as you keep up on your maintenance and prayers.

That being said, the interior leaves a bit to be desired. Some of the softer plastics will get gooey over time if you're somewhere that gets hot, and once they're soft, they never solidify again. My bimmer has skateboard griptape wrapped around all the door pulls for this reason. Some of the rest of the interior materials are a bit low in quality, which is funny because some of it is very high quality. It contrasts sharply, at least to me. If you compare the three cars you mentioned as far as interior features, the M3 will thoroughly lose. It's an older car, there's no way around it.

I don't know anything firsthand about the Lexus, but from what I've seen and heard, it's a good car, as long as you're fine with being slower than any of it's competitors.

I believe the oldest QV right now will still have a year or so left on the warranty (citation required). As for anything else about the car, I can't say anything that the gentlemen here haven't already said. (I have a 2.0l, anyway.) I can say that when I get out of the Alfa and get into my BMW, it feels like an overweight slug in comparison. The driving dynamics are in a different league entirely. The Alfa is just a lightning rod of fun. And my Giulia is the slow one! Even tooling around town, it's a great experience, whereas the BMW at normal speeds is just... a car.

As far as the lemon thing, it's going to differ on a case-by-case basis. You'd have to find out exactly why the car was lemon'd, and then go see for yourself (or a competent independent mechanic) if it was repaired. Me, personally, would avoid them if possible, but there are those who have had good luck with them.
 

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Reselling the Lemon would be the tricky part I reckon - will normal dealers buy a lemon titled car? Will it dramatically effect the resale value when it comes time to sell it? These are questions I would probably do homework on.
 
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Everyone above make some great points and I’ll throw in my 2 cents. I think the decision in large part rests with you and what your expectations are. I’ll probably take heat for saying this but before I bought my quad I read as many posts on this forum as possible and felt when I made my purchase I had a clear idea of what I’d be getting. In addition to being one of the best sport sedans on the market at any price I knew I’d be getting some quirks. These Italian girls can be finicky and there are no two ways around it. I knew it would have to be hooked to a battery tender as a low battery will provide a Christmas tree of warning lights. I knew mtce outside of a warranty could give accountants a heart attack. I knew I’d need to keep the tank from getting low on gas. I knew that Italians, and Germans bless there hearts still Seem to struggle with electricity so there might be an electrical glitch every now and then. This car will never be as reliable as a Lexus but a lexus will never provide the level of driver engagement as our beloved QVs. As others said above, it’s about your expectations and thickness of your wallet. A lemon that’s been fixed may be just as reliable as other QVs but maybe not. I’d be inclined to avoid a lemon but that’s likely a financial question only you can answer. I own two Alfa’s , 2019 QV and 2020 Stelvio TI sport. Both are the best driving cars on the road imho. If you buy an Alfa just expect she may throw one of the fits Italian woman are known for. 😉. Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
The best way to handle any "should I buy it" questions, especially when comparing different brands, and older cars vs newer, is to put your butt in the seats and go drive them. Not just around the block, take it on the highway, hit some stop lights, drive it like you really plan on driving it (assuming you don't have a scared salesman with you).

We can't possibly know what's going to get your heart going, or what little things will stand out to you personally. I come from a long line of BMWs, but the second I drove a Giulia (not even spec'd how I wanted mine), I knew it was going to be my next car.

Mine is a lemon buyback and I have no regrets. The price was great, the issues were fixed, and I got a warranty with it.
That’s true I would love to go test drive one but since the whole COVID thing I don’t think they’re offering test drives at the moment lol.
 

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when you buy a lemon-titled ANYTHING you assume certain risks, my advice to you is also to look at the Alfa dealer you will be buying? servicing the car from/with. That is the weak link in the Alfa chain, dealer network. Some are EXCEPTIONAL (like my service dealer, my selling, not so much) some are downright lousy to incompetent. Then there is the proximity factor, if you buy one and the closest dealer is over an hour away, be prepared to make that trip when necessary and not cry about it LOL. Let us know what you decide to go with and post pictures!
I wasn’t comparing the E92 and the rc-f to the Qv it’s just cars I’m really interested in and can’t make a final decision because it’s so hard all 3 are wonderful cars. The QV just really has everything I’m looking for but the lemons titles are what’s stopping me. I don’t mind paying 48k but when it has a lemon so it’s like playing Russian roulette I think. I don’t mind driving over a hour to take my car into the dealership to get fixed as long as it’s get fixed you know lmao. But if I do end up buying one I will definitely post pictures and let you guys know cheers! 👍
 

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You should really ask this question to all of us 2.0 owners. The answer is a resounding yes. You are basically asking, should you have a soul to live? Duh. Yes!
Okay so I got a question for all the quad owners, so I’ve been really considering buying this car and it’s between this, a bmw e92 m3 or Lexus rcf or gsf. What are your thoughts.
I'm a lazy person. I try to lease instead of buy unless I fall in love.
I swear I meant it about cars.
Anyway, by that same logic, I avoid Lemons because I don't want that Lemonade. But there are lots of fun people on the planet who take Lemons and make good or bad Lemonade. But yeah, if you can have an Orange as @Triumph23 said... Also @Ryan... & @Flakedsvt & @dontfeedthewriters came out okay, so as I said there are people who know what they are doing and can make good Lemonade... Such a complex question with more complex answers...
The car checks all the boxes for me it’s newer, it’s fast as hell, and I can find with with low miles for a decent price. So the thing that’s been bothering me is most the ones I see the titles are “Lemon” and that’s what stopping me from really pulling the trigger. I’ve also saw other posts of people saying the reliability isn’t good. But I feel like that’s because some people beat the hell out of it, I hope that’s the reason why. But should I risk buying one with a lemon title? What are your thoughts.
I think I like @Giuliano 's answer the best. You know you want the Alfa or move on. Lastly, we all listen to @NAM VET .

Honestly, just do it. What's 50K in a lifetime?
 

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Discussion Starter #20
You didn't say what your intentions are with the car, so I'm going to assume it's going to be a primary transportation. I've been a BMW guy for 10+ years at this point, but at this point, I would not recommend an E92 M3 unless it's a second or third car, only for bombing about on the weekends or something similar. Mainly, due to the fact that the newest E92 is seven-ish years old at this point, and it's going to be really hard, if not impossible, to find one that hasn't been flogged at least some during it's life. Combine that with the fact that it's out of warranty, and any M car can get somewhat expensive to run. They aren't unreliable, but they are high maintenance. I'm not saying you can't find one that's been taken care of and will be reliable and good to you, but I'm saying it's a bit less likely.

The V8 is lovely, but as stated above, a bit lazy at low RPM. It wants to rev, which is fine, because it's one of the most amazing sounding engines BMW has made. The car drives very well, and is a great sports car that still has plenty of practicality. You absolutely can daily it, as long as you keep up on your maintenance and prayers.

That being said, the interior leaves a bit to be desired. Some of the softer plastics will get gooey over time if you're somewhere that gets hot, and once they're soft, they never solidify again. My bimmer has skateboard griptape wrapped around all the door pulls for this reason. Some of the rest of the interior materials are a bit low in quality, which is funny because some of it is very high quality. It contrasts sharply, at least to me. If you compare the three cars you mentioned as far as interior features, the M3 will thoroughly lose. It's an older car, there's no way around it.

I don't know anything firsthand about the Lexus, but from what I've seen and heard, it's a good car, as long as you're fine with being slower than any of it's competitors.

I believe the oldest QV right now will still have a year or so left on the warranty (citation required). As for anything else about the car, I can't say anything that the gentlemen here haven't already said. (I have a 2.0l, anyway.) I can say that when I get out of the Alfa and get into my BMW, it feels like an overweight slug in comparison. The driving dynamics are in a different league entirely. The Alfa is just a lightning rod of fun. And my Giulia is the slow one! Even tooling around town, it's a great experience, whereas the BMW at normal speeds is just... a car.

As far as the lemon thing, it's going to differ on a case-by-case basis. You'd have to find out exactly why the car was lemon'd, and then go see for yourself (or a competent independent mechanic) if it was repaired. Me, personally, would avoid them if possible, but there are those who have had good luck with them.
If I do get a Qv is most likely going to be a weekend/trip car but of course when I get it I’m going to drive it mostly for the first 2months lmao but no I already have a daily and it’s a E46 325ci which I’ve had for about a year now and it’s been doing me good so far with only 155k miles. And exactly that’s why I’m so undecided on the e92 it’s a nice car but to me it’s get outdated but that Naturally aspirated V8 sounds like a monster. Yea your right I might take a chance on one but we’ll see thanks!!😄
 
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